Teacher Feature: Dr. David Reynolds on How Great Discussion Teaches Everyone

Thank you to Dr. David Reynolds for sharing his R.E.A.L. life with us! Dr. Reynolds is an 8th-grade English teacher at Pembroke Hill School in Kansas City (MO) who has just completed his first year with R.E.A.L.® Drawing on over 40 years as a teacher and administrator, he shared his perspective that building a community of trust allows students to move from robotic first attempts to authentic, student-driven discussions that offer insights for everyone in the room. This interview has been lightly edited for clarity.

Name. Dr. David Reynolds

Hometown: Kansas City, Missouri

Current School: Pembroke Hill School (MO)

Teaching assignments: I teach 8th-grade English.

How would you describe yourself as a student?

I was creative and imaginative: I tended to think outside the box.

Who was your favorite teacher when you were a student and why?

In high school, it was Janice Paulson. She was a French teacher, and she’s the person who really inspired me to continue studying French at the college level. I ended up with a degree in French, taught French, and traveled quite a bit to France, where I have lived with French families.

When it comes to class discussion, what is your “why”? What feels compelling and important about teaching discussion skills?

“I want to know their opinions…I’m learning from them as well. I’m learning from their perspectives and how to look at things differently…My perspective is not automatically the right one.”
Dr. David Reynolds, english teacher, Pembroke Hill (MO)

For one thing, discussion is far more interesting than drill-and-kill worksheets. It’s interesting to hear what kids have to say: their thoughts and opinions, and how they perceive things.

I always remind them that if I ask a question, I don’t know the answer to it. I want to know their opinions. When they hear that, I can tell they let their barriers down a little bit, and that makes everyone feel far more comfortable.

I also tell the kids that when we have these discussions, I’m learning from them as well. I’m learning from their perspectives and how to look at things differently. I learn more by listening to them, because my perspective is not automatically the right one.

When it comes to discussion, can you share your top learning goals for your students?

It will sound as if I’m making this up, but the truth is that my goals are the acronym for R.E.A.L. discussion. It’s the 4 things.

Having kids connect with other texts and relate their personal experiences to what they’ve been reading. We spent some time connecting the main characters from both I Was Their American Dream and The Magic Fish in our class discussions.

It’s also important — maybe because I was in debate — to collect evidence to support your response, to find it and to write your notes based on what you want to share with your group.

Kids sometimes struggle with knowing how to ask questions. I always tell them, “No one wants to sit at a family discussion and have it be like a round robin. If I sat at the dinner table with you and just gave you my thoughts or opinions, and no one looked at me and said anything, it’d be strange.” These should feel like a real, natural discussion. They’ve gotten hugely better with practice.

And being good listeners to each other, giving each other eye contact, and listening to each other’s opinions. I have one class with a group that gets a little heated, so I always have to talk about maintaining respect and courtesy, because they’re fine young people who have strong opinions. They’re good, and I enjoy listening to them.

It was a struggle in the beginning, but now they’re far more comfortable as we practice it and get used to it.

I heard you say connection, evidence, questions, and listening, which we recognize as R.E.A.L.®: Relating, Excerpting, Asking, and Listening.

Take us back to the first R.E.A.L. Discussion you led. What were you worried about going into it? What surprised you about it? What was the biggest success in that first discussion cycle?

That’s been a long time ago now — about 9 months — but one of my biggest concerns was helping them understand the protocol, R-E-A-L, and how each part worked. I had done something similar before with reciprocal teaching, so I knew I had to practice with them what each part looked like. We practiced R, then E, then RE, then A, then REA, then L, and finally R-E-A-L together until they felt proficient.

What surprised me was how some of the groups came to it, the quality of the discussions they began to have, and how much they’ve grown throughout the year. At the beginning of the year, it felt very robotic; as the year has progressed, it’s become far more organic and natural.

A big early success was that they were able to identify what they had problems with. After discussion one, going into discussion two, they could name where their bumps in the road were with REAL and think about how to address that. After group share-outs, they would say things like, “We really worked on asking questions this time,” or “We did better listening to each other.” For me, the most striking part was how accurate they were in that reflection — I’d sit with each group (I usually had 4 groups in a class) for about 5 minutes, take notes, and their notes were almost identical to what I had written down. Sometimes they were almost more critical than I was.

What advice would you give to a teacher who’s about to start their first R.E.A.L. discussion cycle?

Not to be in a rush to do all 4 components at one time. Master it.

I have a slide for the protocol. Even now, near the end of the school year, I still review that slide with them. What does R look like? What does E look like? What does A look like? What does L look like? These are the things we’re looking for when we do a R.E.A.L. discussion. Having that constant protocol available has been helpful. I do Google Slides every week, and I always leave it on their slides for the week, so I can easily access it. Especially in the beginning, I would leave it up during the discussion. And I made a slide with Portfolio reminders: citation, quotes, notes and discussion questions.

I would tell other teachers not to worry so much at the beginning — just jump in and do it. Are you going to make mistakes? Yeah, you’re going to make mistakes. Are you going to do it the same way next year? No, you’re not. Are you going to do cycle 2 the same way you did cycle 1? You learn from mistakes, you learn from your errors, and you learn how to do things better. You have to jump in and start doing it and see what happens.

How do you plan for R.E.A.L. discussion?

I take some time to think about what we’ve focused on in class. Those things are what I center the discussion questions around. Sometimes I’ll go into ChatGPT and throw in some notes and say, “Okay, we’ve covered The Magic Fish and I Was Their American Dream, and I’m looking for 2 REAL discussions based upon these 2 novels. One comparing the main characters and others addressing the books’ themes. Give me 5 suggestions.” I’ll look at those suggestions and revise and edit to see which ones I think are better. That’s been helpful. The questions I’ve come up with have been good and high-level.

Over the course of this year, are there particular students whose growth through REAL discussion has stood out to you?

We’ve talked a lot about, going back to I Was Their American Dream, how did their identity form, who they are? How did their personal family story shape their own identity? I had some really interesting students who wanted to talk about their grandparents who were in Vietnam or Japan, or wanted to share their families’ rags-to-riches stories. They really got into talking about their own personal family stories.

I had another student; she told me she did not like talking out loud in class. She enjoys groups of 5 to 7. Recently, she’s volunteered to be the spokesperson for her group in front of the whole class. I think it was about building comfort and trust.

I had another student who has stood out to me more than anyone else. Her parents came to me one day and told me how comfortable she has felt this year [compared to previous years in school]. She loved when we read Fahrenheit 451. She loves dystopian novels. She got into Romeo and Juliet. For extra credit, she made a playlist for one of the characters. Later, she wanted to know if she could share it with the class.

This girl loves theater, she loves drama, and her dad came to me one day and said, “Dr. Reynolds, we have never talked to her about what she wants to do in the future, but she told us she wants to be an English teacher.”

Oh, that’s so touching. I love it.

It was one of those moments where you’ve got to keep from crying.

What inspires you? Do you have a favorite quote right now?

What inspires me is creativity.

I like to think of how we could do things differently and not the same old way, to try to maintain students’ interest, which is challenging. I feel like I’m just not young and fun anymore. So I want to do something that will be fun.

There’s a quote I like. It might sound a bit cliché, but it helps me a lot because I tend to be a worrier sometimes. The quote is, “Stop being afraid of what could go wrong and start being excited about what could go right.” It’s by Tony Robbins.

What’s next for you and your class? Where do you hope to take R.E.A.L. as we wrap up the school year?

Our next book is Twelve Angry Men, and that will complete our 4th cycle.

That’s great that you will get to 2 R.E.A.L. discussions this year.

To get in 12 discussions, you have to plan. Over time, the kids have gotten far more into it than they were at the beginning. At least that’s my impression.

Yes, and you’ve got the data to back that up. It has been a pleasure getting to know you this year. Thank you for your time and energy. I know you’ll be doing some fun things in France this summer and beyond. Maybe our paths will cross again, David.

I hope so. It’d be awesome.

If you’re a teacher interested in learning more about R.E.A.L.® Discussion, visit conversationcomeback.org for Conversation Comeback: A Teacher’s Guide to Class Discussion in a Distracted, Divided World or learn more about our professional learning opportunities, such as workshops, trainings, and retreats.